i want to talk about the number 40. it appears so many times in the bible… it has to be symbolic, and not necessarily literal in all of those cases (remember rob bell’s presentation on numbers).

most recently, today we talked about david vs. goliath and how the armies had a stand-off for 40 days before david arrived and made amends of things…

just finished “the irresistible revolution.” wow. great stuff. chapter 12, the next to last chapter, was my favorite… overall i thought this book got better and better as it progressed. some observations on the church from claiborne:

“…we must never fall in love with our vision or our five-year plan. We must never fall in love with “the revolution” or “the movement.” We can easily become so driven by our vision for church growth, community, or social justice that we forget the little things, like caring for those around us. An older charismatic woman told me, “If the devil can’t steal your soul, he’ll just keep you busy doing meaningless church work … The person who loves their dream of community will end up destroying the community around him, but person who loves those around him will create community.” [I struggle with this, see previous post.]

on his experiences interning at Willow Creek, and their announcement of a $10 mil building addition: “… I did a ton of research on tithes and offerings in scripture, and discovered they are unmistakably intended to be used for redistributing resources to the poor and not to go toward buildings and staff for the church … Scriptures consistently teach that the offering is God’s instrument of resistribution and that it belongs to the poor. Giving to the poor should not make its way into the budget; it is the budget.”

“…the first major organizational structure in the early church was created to assure order in the redistribution of resources to widows and orphans.” [does this sound like the church today? have we really lost our way? we spend much time worshiping and proclaiming God’s name, but how much does that really accomplish for the Kingdom of God? I believe that the term ‘Kingdom of God’ has been wildly distorted… it now means ‘saving more souls so they may enter heaven,’ when I feel like it is supposed to mean, ‘living as a people, the way God intended for us in the beginning’ (which is a huge statement that encompasses much). this includes bringing others in, but by other means than just plain asking them to convert. they should see what we do and want to be a part of it].

“…over 90% (of the churches offerings) was given to the poor. We live in an age when we have nearly reversed what God set in place. An average of 85% of the church offering is used internally, primarily for staff and buildings and stuff to meet our own needs. And this borders on embezzlement, as pointed out by theologian Ray Mayhew…”

Plenty more where that came from, but my fingers are out of energy. He also spoke of a cool network of people all over the world called “Relational Tithe.”

from Jim Wallis’ foreword:

“…The Christiany of private piety, affluent conformity, and only “God Bless America” has compromised the witness of the church while putting a new generation of Christians to sleep. Defining faith by the things you won’t do or question does not create a compelling style of life…”

from Shane himself:

“…Few people are interested in a religion that has nothing to say to the world and offers them only life after death, when what people are really wondering is whether there is life before death…”

“…Even if there were no heaven and there were no hell, would you still follow Jesus? Would you follow him for the life, joy, and fulfillment he gives you right now? … And yet I am convinced that Jesus came not to prepare us to die but to teach us how to live. Otherwise, much of Jesus’ wisdom would prove quite unnecessary for the afterlife. After all, how hard could it be to love our enemies in heaven? And the kingdom that Jesus speaks so much about is not just something we hope for after we die but is something we are to incarnate now. Jesus says the kingdom is ‘within us,’ ‘among us,’ and ‘at hand.’…”

“Is this what Jesus told you guys to do?”

This question gripped me as I read this book. It’s a really, really interesting experiment. Jim Henderson, a Christian and innovative thinker, hired an aethiest, Matt Casper, to visit several churches across the US with him and provide insight into how an aethiest sees our efforts at reaching the world. As they visited Saddleback (where I work), the Dream Center, Willow Creek, and other infulential churches across the US, they record their thoughts…and the thought that rocked me the most was the one mentioned above.

Here’s why this meant so much to me. First, there’s the obvious. From this statement and others made in the book, it is clear that we, as church leaders, are missing something. Many of the methods that so many church leaders see as “culturally relevant” and possible methods as making church more attractive to a non-believer really do nothing but cause scepticism and doubt in the hearts and minds of non-believers. “Culturally relevant” lighting equipment, stage designs, staffing solutions, segmented ministries, slick presentations…you get the point. The obvious point I think I was reminded of here was that, while I enjoy all of these aspects of weekend worship as a believer in Christ, I was reaffirmed that these may actually not be effective in reaching the lost.

The more thought provoking of the challenges in this statement, though, was a second aspect. It wasn’t implied in the book, so these are merely my own thoughts, but I wanted to mention it. Here’s where this statement took me…What if church as we know it…all together…Sunday worship services, midweek Bible studies, staff, bulletins, strategic planning meetings, offices, security…I could go on…what if it all is a mistake?

I’ve been doing some thinking, praying, reading, and such since I started thinking about this. I’m going to keep doing that. I’m studying Jesus’ ministry right now. How did he do it? What were the values that drove his ministry? What were his methods? What were the things that he spoke against?

I would love to lead in a way that I could answer Casper’s question with a definitive “yes!”

From Cesar Millan’s (The Dog Whisperer) book, “Be the Pack Leader:”

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“Dogs are all about the pack. They are guided by an instinctual way of being that we humans can have access to if we simply say, “I am here to live every moment to the fullest; to fulfill my own life and to help fulfill everybody else around me.” I owe a huge debt of gratitude to dogs for the values they have taught me – such as honesty, integrity, consistency, and loyalty. These are the qualitites that make a true pack leader.”

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He has a great outlook on life… his goal is to help dogs and people become more balanced, with the goal of “helping put our world back into balance.” Sound familiar?

I love Rob Bell… literally… the day and a half seminar with him in Atlanta changed the way I think forever; I wish we could do it again. I would pay good money…

I really enjoyed his “Everything is Spiritual” presentation… it was a foundational message, that I thought to be geared toward the non-believer or the doubter of the creation model. He brings up some of the science that is just too good to be true to sustain life; all the equilibriums, gas levels, etc… “The Case for a Creator” was in his list of resources.

He then shifted toward the human element… and I go blank here (I need to watch it again) on his points… but I remember him beginning at two ends of a spectrum: the spiritual end, and the ‘earthly’, or created end… and how, as humans, we are ultimately the center of the spectrum – where the spiritual realm and the created realm meet… and we are the only beings with that status… I need to watch it again…

One point regarding the Church was mentioned that I agree with and have for some time: first of all, God created this place and everything in it; we can’t hide from His presence nor escape His beauty. Everyday tasks are spiritual… no, they don’t have to involve praying or singing, etc… but just ‘being’ what we created to be is a spiritual thing.

Fast forward to the Church: he says that one thing we have to be careful of is making it feel like ‘church’ is where we come to ‘meet’ God, or that it’s where God ‘is’. And that He’s not necessarily everywhere else (I don’t mean explicitly saying this… just creating an environment that emits this feeling)… over time we can sink this attitude into our church-goers, and it can be harmful to our overall perspective of who and what God is. [nothing mind-blowing, I know… but I thought it worth mentioning in this setting.]

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My ideal picture of the Church is a community of people committed to living the life they were created to live, every second of their life… committed to living the way of Jesus… and that the weekly gathering is simply the place where we come together, as one of the many facets of that lifestyle; where we come and celebrate the God who created us and the life of Jesus as a group… whether that means through teaching, song, other art forms; sharing, hanging out and developing relationships…

I feel like we really uphold the Sunday gathering as a sacred time, as we should. But we isolate it. It becomes the only time that really matters. There is a gap between our levels of reverence toward Church and the rest of the week that needs to narrow… we need to revere our lives as a beautiful, intentional creation just as much.

I don’t want in any way to devalue the Sunday gathering, but to uphold it with the utmost reverence… what I would like to see is us bringing the rest of our lives, the other 6 and a half days, up to that level of sacredness…

so we have this goal of eventually starting something… whatever that may be. and that’s super exciting to me. but it also causes a certain struggle for me. i have this grandiose picture of doing something worthwhile… something we were created to do and that we’ve spent years developing and putting into place. i want to spend my time efficiently in preparation… developing into a leader in many different capacities.

but sometimes with that comes a fear that i’m not doing a very good job of living in the moment… being here, right now. being a Christ follower, with a role in this phase of my life, and what that means to the people and environment around me. i only have so much energy to exert…. how do we balance a) putting so much energy into looking forward with b) focusing on just ‘being’?

side note: just watched the “everything is spiritual” presentation by rob bell… more on that later.

i dig your statement, “…people who eventually move from dialogue to reality.” i get the name now; it has more meaning when paired with that statement.

that night was pretty unsettling. there was something there. they weren’t empty words. there was potential brewing in the room and a real vision of something bigger… there was a certain young selfishness behind it (the thought of being ‘influential’ people, i suppose), but it was more unselfish than selfish… either way i think we’ve grown out of that mindset as we’ve moved through the years.

there exists within this conversation a heart to make things better; to debunk old, stagnent philosophies and get back to their origins… respecting where they came from and embracing their good, but at the same time removing the ‘chaff’. not upholding a ritual or tradition just for the sake of ritual.

it was around that time that i began to get frustrated with the church in general. there was, growing in our society, an idea of what a church had to look like in order to be legitimate. there had to be a band. cool video screens with sweet graphics. there had to be a sense of awe in the presentation…. but at the same time, i (i think we actually) felt like we had lost the idea of what they were all about… our role in the community… (but lots of factors and issues contribute to this and i know it’s hard to ‘be’ a church….) i say poop on all that…. more on that later.

this ramble must end now! i’m excited…

One night…wow, was it 5 years ago?…Brandon, Trevor, Lyndsey, Austin and I sat in an office at church. We had just finished a midweek youth group meeting. I think it was a good one, because we were all in really good spirits…and we started dreaming. The question eventually landed at “What would it look like if we all started a church together?”. We started dreaming about what all of our roles would be…we thought a lot about where we would do it (I think all of us but Trevor landed on Denver- hilarious to think about now)…and we kinda dreamt a little about what the purpose of our Church would be. I remember Austin leaving to go home and get some sleep for school…Lyndsey left and Brandon said he would be close behind…and Trevor took off to get home for school too…And then Brandon and I sat around there for hours continuing to dream. That night is one I’ve thought about probably 200+ times since then…and about 6 months ago I found out that Brandon had never let go of that dream either. I had continued to minister in MTV for a few more years and then moved to the OC to work at Saddleback Church. Brandon had finished undergrad work in education and was teaching at Edwardsville High School. I was still single and on the ride of my life with my career. Brandon was newly married and was settling into a new life too. Both of us continued to think about this dream…what would it look like if we were journeying together again?. Both of our journeys in faith and church have been…hmmm…interesting. Sometimes it has been unbelievably inspiring, and other times disappointing…a lot of really powerful ministry moments and a lot of frustrating “church” stuff…Interesting journeys to say the least. Through it all, we’ve begun to ask some questions. Questions like “what does God care about?”…or “what if we don’t already know it all?”…or “what if it really was all about Him? what would that look like?”. That’s what this is all about. This is a place of dialogue as we start on this journey. Brandon and I aren’t really sure where this is going to lead. We think we have an idea, but honestly, we really aren’t sure. What we do know, though, is that we want to be people who eventually move from dialogue to reality. We want to search for answers together and live them out…and we want to invite others to journey along with us…to dialogue and live in a new reality. So…we begin. It’s exciting really…to think that we’re open to change. Openness is the idea that there is more out there…that there is more growth to be experienced…that there is more life to be lived. Progress almost always begins with openness. Dreams take root and become reality when the dreamer is open. And most of the great movements in history have been birthed out of openness. So we begin…to be open…and to share it on here…here we go…